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Post by Deleted on Aug 23, 2019 23:10:29 GMT
Westie, Sorry to be asking you this daft question. I know you've had a few Linn Classik's. Do they sound decent?
S.
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Bigman80
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Post by Bigman80 on Aug 23, 2019 23:45:41 GMT
If you like Linn CD players and amps you won’t be disappointed. They retain all the same characteristics. That slightly “clipped” delivery gives a very metronomic timing.
They do suffer from a common fault of not coming out of standby though. I wouldn’t pay a lot for one because of that risk. Good sounding, nice to use and well built though.
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Bigman80
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Post by Bigman80 on Aug 24, 2019 17:04:26 GMT
Well I’ve had a funny old day.
Started with the Nait in place of the Campion. It’s wickedly fun and it has a very different gain structure which makes it sound very lively. Switching back to the Sonneteer is like seeing that face on Mars when the higher resolution pic was taken. The level of extra clarity and definition was startling.
So, next was to try the Nait in the bedroom system. It’s directly above the listening room with same bay and side walls. It’s only about 13 feet deep though and the listening room is probs about 23 or 24.
I’ve been using Elas for a few weeks and they have never sounded right. I even suspected a fault. Of course the Nait would breathe life into them? Wrong, it was even worse than the T amp. The Elas sounded so dull I even checked for blown tweeters. Next I was researching the crossover because there just had to be a fault. I put the DIY Cubettes back in and they sounded great, so I was now certain the Elas were broken.
Just to be sure I tried them in the main system downstairs and they sounded as good as I’ve heard from Elas. Then I tried the Nait with them and again they sounded great.
It just goes to show how big a factor the room can be. Never in my life have I experienced a speaker sounding broken in one room and fab in another, especially in the same house!
I guess the Elas will stay in the other front room as ornaments. They don’t work in the master bedroom and I have better speakers for the listening room. That means I have no practical use for them. Too awkward to ship over to Cyprus when the time comes, too. Such is life.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 24, 2019 17:57:29 GMT
You have good ears, Westie.
Would you say the Nait 2 sounds a little smoother than the 1?
S.
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Bigman80
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Post by Bigman80 on Aug 24, 2019 18:05:27 GMT
You have good ears, Westie. Would you say the Nait 2 sounds a little smoother than the 1? S. That’s not hard to do lol. I think it’s probably more “fleshed out” and less breathless. I think you can listen longer with Nait 2. Can I give you a food analogy? Dark chocolate has a sweet spot somewhere around 70% for me. Sometimes even lower content can be yummy. Maybe higher or lower for others. Nait 1 is the 85% stuff. Very intense but you won’t sit down and eat a whole bar. I could’ve used curry or chilli analogies either. Same thing though: Nait 1 is a bit intense for longer listens. Nait 2 might give slightly less of a high, but it lasts a lot longer. Otherwise it would’ve been on EBay now lol.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 24, 2019 20:16:02 GMT
Great analogy, makes sense.
How does the 42/110 sound if compared to the Nait 2? I know you have had a good few 42/110, hence why I'm asking.
S.
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Bigman80
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Post by Bigman80 on Aug 24, 2019 21:01:00 GMT
Naim pre/powers are weightier. They are also less capable of giving spatial info. 42/110 is a bit of a sweet spot in the pre/powers because the weight is still reasonably balanced and there’s a sweetness of tone compared to lots of Naim. Nait 2 is closer in tone to 42/110. Not as weighty but a bit more nimble and definitely less “flat earth”.
FWIW I reckon the SNAIC configuration of running signal and power in one lead is the thing that gives that flat earth lack of air and space. Nait doesn’t have such a wire config and is therefore a bit different. Could just be me talking bollocks though.
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Post by macca on Aug 25, 2019 10:00:18 GMT
Could also be the active pre-amp. Most active pres are crap. I don't know but I suspect that the Nait and Nait 2 have passive pre-amp stages.
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Bigman80
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Post by Bigman80 on Aug 26, 2019 15:12:21 GMT
Kans almost finished. Spicas just started by priming the sanded and prepped cabinets. Ran out of primer, grrrr! Still, it’s a reason to have. a cycle out tomorrow. I have the zebrano never veneer, but I’ve decided to try them black ash first. They already had ash veneer on them and I really dig the black wood stain when it’s on. I can always change my mind but black ash keeps them stock and let’s me ramp up the standard of finish.
The felts are being sprayed black with a fabric spray. That mottled grey finish of the originals is hideous. Grilles are original and near perfect with only one tiny hole. I’d replace them but I can’t get the exact grille fabric, so it’s a “no go”.
If only I liked black, it would be a fab project!
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Post by dsjr on Aug 26, 2019 15:51:33 GMT
Umm - here I go again - The ancient Naim amp design calls for a band limited active buffer between input and power amp stages and this was so tightly designed towards old sources, the 2V output of a CD player taxed it greatly for volume use, as nine o'clock was pretty near the amp clipping point with a CD source. www.hifi4sale.net/t25075-naim-nait-2-olive-soldA google search gives the full size internal view. Phono stage coming down from the sockets, then the muting relay and bits to operate it, the preamp part at the front near the volume control. The power amps are near the speaker sockets behind the mains transformer, which was bigger than the Nait 1 from memory.
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Bigman80
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Post by Bigman80 on Aug 26, 2019 16:45:45 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Aug 26, 2019 16:47:41 GMT
Nice!
S.
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Bigman80
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Post by Bigman80 on Aug 26, 2019 17:38:10 GMT
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Bigman80
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Post by Bigman80 on Aug 27, 2019 10:05:31 GMT
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Post by Bigman80 on Aug 27, 2019 10:19:56 GMT
Better than white lol
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Post by Deleted on Aug 27, 2019 14:07:38 GMT
Big transformation. Good work!
S.
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Bigman80
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Post by Bigman80 on Aug 27, 2019 15:41:38 GMT
Big transformation. Good work! S. Cheers, Shane. Black wood dye is definitely the way to go for restoring black speakers. If anyone’s interested I used Liberon Palette Ebony wood dye, applied with a 2 inch foam brush. Wax finish is Bri Wax clear. Now I can get on with restoring my Spicas. A pair of Spendor Preludes landed today and they also need a serious refurb. I plan to take my time.
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Post by antonio on Aug 27, 2019 16:01:44 GMT
Definitely better than the white finish before, but if you'd finished them off in matt white I'm sure they would've looked great as well.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 27, 2019 16:06:45 GMT
Nice job there Andrew. They look good.
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Bigman80
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Post by Bigman80 on Aug 27, 2019 16:40:00 GMT
Definitely better than the white finish before, but if you'd finished them off in matt white I'm sure they would've looked great as well. You’d lose all the grain and it would devalue them imo. They look like factory finish which was my aim. I really wasn’t in control of the outcome. The Ronseal stripper simply lifted everything away perfectly. The paint layer had protected the underneath, so I inherited a very tidy pair. Then the black dye did such a fab job. The polish is always a pretty easy and safe option, giving a decent sheen.
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Post by macca on Aug 27, 2019 16:43:44 GMT
They do look factory fresh now, no doubt about it.
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Bigman80
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Post by Bigman80 on Aug 27, 2019 16:53:14 GMT
They do look factory fresh now, no doubt about it. Good job they were actually ash underneath. DSJR is right especially with mk1 Kans and Sara’s. Anything with flaws was just fixed up and finished as “black ash”. The Spendors are “mahogany” insofar as someone has covered them in mahogany stain and varnish. The grain looks to be walnut. I’m hoping the paint stripper will do the same job again and I can just Danish oil them. Can I be lucky again? I hope so. Why do people with no skills or standards ever think they can stain or paint hifi? It still amazes me.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 27, 2019 17:24:32 GMT
They do look factory fresh now, no doubt about it. Good job they were actually ash underneath. DSJR is right especially with mk1 Kans and Sara’s. Anything with flaws was just fixed up and finished as “black ash”. The Spendors are “mahogany” insofar as someone has covered them in mahogany stain and varnish. The grain looks to be walnut. I’m hoping the paint stripper will do the same job again and I can just Danish oil them. Can I be lucky again? I hope so. Why do people with no skills or standards ever think they can stain or paint hifi? It still amazes me.Yes, it's very annoying to those of us who really know what they're doing!
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Post by dsjr on Aug 27, 2019 17:44:34 GMT
Back in the day, Spendor did teak (the most popular sellers for us), Rosewood (a deep characterful black grained red either enhanced by staining or a decent veneer as I believe rosewood is actually a reddish brown in real life?) and maybe Walnut and Black, I can't fully remember...
When rosewood became economically unobtainable, some speaker makers cobbled together a 'rosenut,' colour, which I took to be stained walnut - ugh... Cherry is another one, often stained a deep orange to hide th enatural darkening of the veneers in a fairly short time. My Arca cabinet was dark when I bought it and it still is pretty much, seventeen years on. My twelve year old Harbeths in cherry are still pretty light in shade if not as 'yellow' as they were when new.
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Post by macca on Aug 27, 2019 18:11:54 GMT
Walnut is my favourite. It always seems to be the most expensive finish though.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 27, 2019 18:18:34 GMT
I like Oak.
S.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 27, 2019 18:20:34 GMT
Walnut is my favourite. It always seems to be the most expensive finish though. I veneered a pair of Tannoys in Indian Rosewood years ago. That wasn't cheap. Looked fantastic once finished though.
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Bigman80
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Post by Bigman80 on Aug 27, 2019 18:57:34 GMT
Walnut is my favourite. It always seems to be the most expensive finish though. Burr walnut needs a vacuum bag to get it flat. If you’ve got the gear, it’s still one of the absolute finest finishes you can get.
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Bigman80
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Post by Bigman80 on Aug 28, 2019 9:15:26 GMT
Ive been playing with the Spendor Preludes. It’s hard to imagine anyone thinking their sound is “correct”. Listening to music with them is like trying to appreciate a stunning woman’s Figure when she’s wearing 10 layers of baggy clothing. They just put so many layers over the music, they cover up all its facets. I guess some folk must just need sanitised smoothness.
On closer inspection, the finish appears original, so I may just touch up the odd blemish and leave alone. I don’t like messing with originality. Someone will appreciate these, even though I don’t.
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Post by dsjr on Aug 28, 2019 10:27:00 GMT
The SA2/Prelude/SP2/Harbeth Compact whatever do have mid bass prominence with little very low down and I remember the BC1 started out this size but Spencer H enlarged the speaker cabs to improve things before production started (it's in s file somewhere, I think on the Yahoo group files). I thought the Prelude crossovers weren't the same as the better specced SA2's but could be wrong. The bass drivers use crimped tags I think to connect where the SA2/BC2/BC3 drivers have 4mm binding posts. The upper mids do recess a little compared to Kans for example which peak up*, so if you and your room prefer the peaky Kan balance (measurable fact not purely opinion), then NO 'flatter' speaker will sound 'right' to you. I find almost all Kans shrill and shreiky-peaky as I do smaller Cubes, but you and others don't, so horses for courses. My harbeths sound fine if pulled well out from the back wall as many are used worldwide, but I can't keep them there, so they have to be moved around too much for me. One thing I have no idea on with your pair is the tweeter. Many nearly forty year old tweeters tend to lose output over the years and I don't think the Audax was entirely immune (the SEAS? driver used in Mission 770's tamed beautifully after twenty years, losing the sparkle they had when new). I'm shouting into the void here I know, but if you used the Preludes on high stands away from walls for a day or so, i wonder if you'd start to get used to the understated way they have in comparison with the more 'forward' speakers it appears you like? * - The BC2/SA2/Prelude/BBC used driver has phase issues and a peak at or near the crossover point compared to the smaller coil BC1/SA1 driver and the descended SP1 driver which had an anonymous non-showy phase plug added to the pole piece. The BBC way was to reduce output here so it wasn't as noticeable rather than let it fly as so-called 'flat earth' speakers did. This characteristic is easily measurable and heard too, especially as the smaller SA2/Prelude boxes focus attention on the mid bass (it's obvious to me that Spen's son who designed them isn't particularly a rock music fan). The later 'BBC' LS5/8 and 5/9 magnified this upper mid dip and the current Graham 5/9 does it just as much as the original. Properly positioned and driven (the Sonneteer should be perfect if it's similar to the Alabaster I know), it should give a deep soundstage rather than a projected one i think. How much did you pay for the vinyl wrap cab Preludes? ten years ago, £80 - £100 was a good price for these..
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