Not really fair as the Krell would be on the way to ten grand if still made and the NVA is what now? £330?
Sound-wise they are chalk and cheese. The Krell gives more of a studio sound, the NVA, as everyone says, majors on the music and the performance. It sounds like a good push-pull EL84 valve amp. It paints in broad strokes with a 'glow' around everything. It's an impressive sound but it doesn't show up the differences in recordings whereas the Krell does. And I like that. But I reckon a good percentage of people would prefer the NVA sound. I'm just not one of them.
I changed tack a couple of years back and decided to go for an 'objectivist' system just to see what it was like. In other words buy stuff based on good technical spec alone. Quite like what I've got now and it is very close to being exactly what I want, but it wouldn't suit everyone.
I’ll let this run for now as I hope it can clear the air and perhaps allow a chance to air or work out any differences. In the long run though, I want to keep this forum focused on the gear. If anyone wants to use this forum as neutral ground to organise any bake-offs or get togethers, they are welcome to do so.
I really want to keep this forum away from inter forum arguments, but if it can help people get together and actually listen to stuff, than that’s a good thing AFAIC. Pity I’m too far away to join in.
I know we only have a handful of members but if anyone wants to join just to host any get together, then please do.
Personally I’d prefer a tandem loan arrangement if I was in the market for two competing products.
1. Draw up a list of interested parties. 2. First person gets a fire bottle and NVA sent to him. Listens then sends them as a package to number 2 and so on. 3. Some form of feedback would be nice but it doesn’t have to turn into a battle. At the end of the day it’s about the recipient being able to get a heads up,on what suits them. It’s likely both companies will get sales. If not, then one will probably get an education.
With phono stages it gets a bit trickier but you could have a 2 round contest. First round MM, Second Round MC with agreed settings.
Far better to hear stuff in your own system and in your own time without other people to influence you,
If it has to be a bake off, I think you might benefit from getting some rest like Savvy to negotiate terms on neutral territory. He can do it here if he likes, on a thread or by PM. From what I gather he’s a former negotiator. Yes, I know it shouldn’t need a negotiator...... it’s not like there’s a hostage situation, but if it gets you what you want then why not?
These days I’m nobody’s friend, ally or fan, so doing something here would remove any issues of playing at “home” or “away”, I don’t even have any intention of buying a phono stage, so I have no axe to grind and I really don’t care who “wins”. To me, the folks getting a free listen are the winners.
I completely agree which is why I am running a NVA loan scheme, where any member of HFS can have a loan of available NVA product. I am a great fan of this way of doing business, but it seems I am the only one. I have tried to get other forums to host them, and for a while TAS did it with great success for members, and a few sales for me, so the other trade objected, and the usual Dunn haters (like with this bake-off) sabotaged the process, so it was banned.
You are too small to have any influence as a forum Westie but in time perhaps you could become a middle ground where this could be done in a way you suggest. BUT don't hold your breath, just watch as you and your forum are drawn into the bullshit, they will stop you anyway they can. It is not in the interest of the slurpers in this industry to have fair comparisons, that is why forums have been hi-jacked and commercial blogs and magazines are bribed with advertising money.
You’re right that size matters and we are Liechtenstein or maybe even the Duchy of Grand Fenwick!
Y’know if Alan or anyone wants to sell more Phono Stages they could do a lot worse than start their own loan scheme on AoS or wherever. It cannot possibly do any harm. I don’t know how many he’s sold but he will surely sell more this way. If he or anyone does start loans, there will inevitably be people who loan yours and their products. That can only be good for everyone, especially the people getting to choose in their own home.
I watched how it all unfolded, but its made NVA forbidden fruit in many ways. If I was trying to market something, getting it censored would be a great tactic, especially getting a big banner erected telling everyone’s it was banned. I’d imagine it probably boosts rather than dampens interest.
I’d also imagine that contentious discussions and rows would be good for forum traffic, so banning a topic that everyone tuned in to read about would decrease interest in the forum.
It’s all too easy to assume forums matter at all though. I have a good few Hi-Fi mates. Not a single one even glances at forums. They even look blankly when I mention the forum names. I’d love to know how many buyers of new kit have anything to do with Hi-Fi forums. I bet it’s very low. So many people on forums either DIY or buy used.
This started as a loan scheme on TAS Westie. Many members embraced it but bit by bit, other trade parties complained, despite these loans being free and with absolutely no add-ons apart from the request to report what was heard, good and bad. The complainers won out eventually and the loan scheme was abandoned for a while. It's started upon HFS again, but I have nothing to do with it as 'The Doc' likes to know exactly where things are.
When this scheme was on TAS, the request was repeatedly made for other manufacturers to join in. MCRU was one of the most vociferous against it and I believe it was only afterwards that Stan Beresford expressed an interest. I believe you were around at the time and must remember the shananigans...